Grow Your Camp Podcast By Mark P. Fisher & Carl Lefever cover art

Grow Your Camp

Grow Your Camp

By: Mark P. Fisher & Carl Lefever
Listen for free

Welcome to the Grow Your Camp Podcast: Because You Can't Minister to Empty Beds

Helping Christian retreat centers grow in mission and margin.

Hosts:

Mark P. Fisher, of Inspiring Growth

Carl Lefever, of Improve & Grow

Overview:

This podcast is designed to inspire and equip camp leaders to grow their camps through stories and systems. It is meant to be a place where camp leaders learn how practical marketing systems can amplify their ministry impact—without losing sight of their mission.

Key Themes:

  • Filling the Calendar: Strategies and real-world examples of how retreat and camp leaders increase bookings and reduce seasonal gaps. Topics might include: lead generation systems, improving inquiry response times, pricing strategy, market positioning, capacity management, and off-season marketing approaches.
  • Marketing that Feels Like Ministry: How faith-driven leaders approach marketing as an extension of their mission rather than a distraction from it. Topics might include: values-based storytelling, ethical persuasion, branding that builds trust, and aligning marketing messages.
  • Digital Growth Systems: Modern tools and digital marketing tactics that consistently drive visibility, inquiries, and revenue for retreats and camps. Topics might include: websites that convert, CRM and automation, SEO and Google Ads, social media advertising, online reviews, and emerging technologies like AI.
  • Stories of Growth: Candid conversations with leaders about their challenges, breakthroughs, and the turning points that sparked momentum. Topics might include: turning around a struggling retreat season, launching new programs, rebuilding after crisis, or scaling operations while staying mission-aligned.
  • Leading for Growth: How leadership mindset, team culture, and operational systems create the foundation for sustainable growth. Topics might include: team alignment, delegation, budgeting and stewardship, guest experience excellence, and building systems that support long-term ministry impact.

Episodes are 25-45 minutes in length, content is fun, engaging and practical. We bring on reputable guests that work in or on camp and always include a quick camp marketing tip at the top of each episode.

Have a specific question you'd like us to cover? Click here to record a question and submit to our team.

2026 Mark P. Fisher & Carl Lefever
Episodes
  • Ep 6 | From Empty Beds to a Waiting List

    Ep 6 | From Empty Beds to a Waiting List
    Apr 3 2026

    In this episode, Carl shares a camp marketing tip on how answering unasked questions on your website can dramatically increase retreat inquiries. Then Mark sits down with John Schwieterman, Executive Director of Cross Oaks Camp and Retreat Center, to unpack how he transformed a struggling camp into a rapidly growing operation.

    John shares the real story behind that growth—from cold calling hundreds of churches with limited results to implementing a system that now generates consistent inbound leads and an 88% close rate. They walk through the practical changes that made the difference, including website improvements, digital marketing strategy, and the leadership shift required to stop doing everything alone.

    You’ll hear what actually worked, what didn’t, and how to think about growth as both an operational and strategic challenge. If you’re trying to fill more beds, increase bookings, or move your camp out of survival mode, this episode gives you a clear, real-world example of what that path can look like.

    Keywords

    camp growth, retreat bookings, camp marketing, lead generation, website optimization, digital marketing, camp leadership, nonprofit growth, camp revenue, guest groups

    Key Topics
    • Why most camp websites fail to convert inquiries
    • The shift from cold outreach to inbound lead generation
    • Website structure and FAQ strategy for better conversions
    • Using Google Ads and SEO to drive qualified leads
    • Improving close rates with better lead quality
    • The operational challenges that come with growth
    • Leadership mindset: when and how to ask for help
    • Measuring ROI on marketing investments
    Hosts

    Mark P. Fisher, Inspiring Growth
    Carl Lefever, Improve & Grow

    Guest

    John Schwieterman, Executive Director
    Cross Oaks Camp and Retreat Center

    Chapters

    00:00 Introduction and Episode Overview
    02:00 Camp Marketing Tip: Answering Unasked Questions
    05:08 John’s Camp Story and Background
    08:48 Challenges Facing Camp Growth
    12:45 Early Growth Efforts and Cold Calling Strategy
    18:48 Realizing the Need for Help
    21:16 Investing in Marketing and Systems
    23:24 Website and Lead Generation Transformation
    27:46 Results: Higher Close Rates and Revenue Growth
    30:29 The Operational Reality of Growth
    31:54 Leadership Lessons and Asking for Help
    33:08 Advice for Executive Directors
    35:03 Understanding Marketing ROI
    39:26 Time Management and Scaling Leadership

    Resources

    Cross Oaks Camp and Retreat Center – https://crossoaks.com
    Google for Nonprofits – https://www.google.com/nonprofits
    HubSpot CRM – https://www.hubspot.com
    Grow Your Camp Podcast – https://growyourcamppodcast.com

    Have a question you'd like us to cover on a future podcast?

    Click here to record your question >

    If this episode was helpful to you:
    • Follow / subscribe to the podcast
    • Share it with another camp leader who could benefit
    Show more Show less
    40 mins
No reviews yet