Today we are joined by Dr. John Lundwall (PhD, comparative myth and religion), to share what he believes is the BIGGEST anachronism in the book of Mormon – the text itself.

Using his expertise in ancient religions and how they are practiced, Dr. Lundwall offers an analysis of the religious cultures that exist in the Book of Mormon and how they are inconsistent with any other ancient religious practices. He examines early religious expression through rock art, solar deities, and ritual spaces, highlighting how ancient belief systems were primarily oral, symbolic, and embodied—expressed through ritual, chant, and performance rather than writing. He then contrasts this with the Book of Mormon’s highly text-centered nature, beginning with its very first page.

We will also discuss the religious cultures that exist in the Book of Mormon and how they are inconsistent with what we know about ancient societies. Dr. Lundwall explores how writing developed historically, and how religious knowledge was typically preserved and transmitted through oral tradition rather than written records. He will also discuss the “Golden Plates” at length, and share his insight on why their creation would have been highly unlikely for cultures of this time period.

___________________

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Welcome to Part 36 of our Joseph Smith Podcast series with Dr. John Turner covering his new book “Joseph Smith: Rise and Fall of an American Prophet.”

Today we are covering Chapter 28: "Anointed" that covers 1843.

In this episode, we explore one of the most explosive and painful chapters in early Mormon history –Emma Smith’s direct opposition to Joseph Smith over the practice of polygamy. As tensions rise within Nauvoo, Emma confronts the growing reality of plural marriage, leading to deep personal conflict, secrecy, and division.

We examine Joseph Smith’s controversial marriages, including his sealing to Helen Mar Kimball, and the broader system that introduced young women into polygamy –often through pressure, family influence, and religious framing. Through firsthand accounts, journals, and later testimonies, we unpack the human cost of these relationships and the theological justification behind them.

This episode also dives into Doctrine and Covenants 132 –the pivotal revelation on plural marriage –exploring its origins, its impact on Emma, and the broader implications for Mormon theology and authority. We discuss questions surrounding consent, power, sexuality, and the role of women, alongside the cultural and religious environment that allowed polygamy to take root.

As the conflict escalates, Emma begins pushing back –publicly and privately –while Joseph attempts to solidify the practice doctrinally. The episode culminates in one of the most controversial and secretive ordinances in Mormonism: the Second Anointing.

If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series here. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!

Purchase John Turner’s book here.

Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.

___________________

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

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🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Joining John & Mergi Dehlin today is Chelsey Rencher Liaga, here to share her Mormon story of how she was “groomed” for Mormon motherhood, and how this hindered the development of her own mental health and self identity.

Chelsey was born in Gilbert, Arizona (a heavily Mormon community) and had a typical Mormon upbringing. She suffered from perfectionism as a child, which later led to body dysmorphia issues and an eating disorder that affected her time on her mission in Spokane, Washington.

After her mission she met her husband at BYU, and they quickly started building their perfect Mormon family. Chelsey describes the stress she felt early on in their marriage to cook, clean, and uphold the household, and how she eventually overcame this stressor.

She also details her career as a therapist, her experiences as a working mother, and working at LDS family services.

Topics include:

-Perfectionism

-Purity culture

-Motherhood

-Mixed faith marriage

-Mixed race marriage

-Mental Health

This is a pervasive issue in Mormonism that we know many Mormon women can relate to, and hope that Chelsey’s story can help other LDS women feel seen.

TRIGGER WARNING: This episode discusses eating disorders. Please listen responsibly.

___________________

Show Notes

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

Venmo: https://account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories

Paypal: https://paypal.me/mormonstories

Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Following the passing of my dear friend and former BYU professor, Dr. William Bradshaw, we are honoring his life today by re-broadcasting my interview with him from 2010.

The original description for this episode is as follows:

"In this episode, John Dehlin interviews one of his former professors and mentors, Dr. William Bradshaw, on a wide variety of topics. Dr. Bradshaw has just recently retired from a rich and fulfilling career as a molecular biology professor at BYU in which he influenced thousands of students to continually be open to the best thinking of the sciences while still nurturing a robust, mature faith and spiritual life. Many report Dr. Bradshaw’s classes and their various interactions with him as pivotal to their finding a way to value the wisdom generated in both their heads and their hearts.

In this far-ranging discussion, Dr. Bradshaw takes us through the arc of his life, including his mission, experiences at Harvard, the circumstances of his career choice, and the surprise call he and his wife Marge received to serve as very young mission presidents in Hong Kong, during which service they had to wrestle with opening and closing missionary work in Vietnam. Dr. Bradshaw relates stories from his career at BYU, talks about science and religion issues, and reveals the way he faces challenges to his faith from Mormon history and scriptural studies.

Many Mormon Stories podcast listeners will already be familiar with one aspect of Dr. Bradshaw’s life from Episode 191, which featured a recording of the most recent lecture he gave at BYU on the biological origins of homosexuality–a lecture he has arranged and given every year for the past several years. Dr. Bradshaw first became prompted to study the research on this subject when his son Brett came out about his homosexuality. Since that time, the Bradshaws have been active members in various LDS groups for families working to support their LGBT children."

Dr. Bradshaw's funeral will be held at the Orem Stake Chapel (365 South 900 East, Orem, UT 84097) on April 3rd at 11:00 AM.

___________________

Show Notes

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

Venmo: https://account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories

Paypal: https://paypal.me/mormonstories

Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

🍎Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mormon-stories-lds/id312094772

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Join us to speak with Bridget Read about her new article in New York Magazine entitled "Under the Mormon Influence: How the Women of Utah Blogged and Posted Their Way Into American Hearts and Wallets."

Bridget Read has been a writer at New York Magazine since 2019 and is the author of "Little Bosses Everywhere: How the Pyramid Scheme Shaped America."

If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series here. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!

Purchase John Turner’s book here.

Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.

___________________

Show Notes

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

Venmo: https://account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories

Paypal: https://paypal.me/mormonstories

Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

🍎Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mormon-stories-lds/id312094772

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Contact us:

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Welcome back to Part 35 of our series with Dr. John Turner discussing his new book “Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet.”

In 1843, Joseph Smith began introducing some of his closest family members – including his wife Emma Smith and his brother Hyrum Smith –to the controversial and secretive practice of plural marriage.

This episode dives into one of the most complex and debated periods of early Latter-day Saint history. We explore the story of the Kinderhook Plates –a set of six brass plates that briefly captured Joseph Smith’s attention before being exposed as a fraud –and what that moment reveals about claims of translation and discernment.

We also examine the marriages to the Partridge sisters, the dynamics between Joseph and Emma, and the growing theological framework surrounding celestial marriage, “calling and election made sure,” and eternal hierarchy. As new doctrines emerged, secrecy, trust, and power became deeply intertwined.

This episode raises difficult questions such as: What happened to the Kinderhook Plates –and why didn’t the translation continue? How did plural marriage unfold behind the scenes? What did Joseph teach privately vs publicly? How did those closest to him respond about polygamy?

This is a careful, long-form discussion intended to slow down and examine the historical record in detail.

If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series here. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!

Purchase John Turner’s book here.

Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.

___________________

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

Venmo: https://account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories

Paypal: https://paypal.me/mormonstories

Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Today, Debora Meireles Ling joins John and Margi to share her journey growing up in a deeply orthodox LDS family in Brazil, where Mormonism shaped nearly every part of her life. As a teenager, Debora felt intense pressure to live the gospel perfectly and struggled with perfectionism as she tried to meet the expectations placed on faithful members.

Debora was called to serve a mission in the São Paulo South Mission, but the experience quickly became overwhelming. After experiencing severe anxiety and panic attacks, she was sent home early—a devastating event she initially interpreted as a punishment from God. She reflects on the emotional toll of mission culture and the challenges missionaries can face when mental health struggles arise.

After returning home, Debora worked to rebuild her life while remaining deeply committed to her faith. She eventually married a fellow returned missionary, and together they tried to build the kind of life they had always been taught to pursue within the Church. Over time, however, new questions and experiences began to challenge some of the assumptions she had carried for most of her life.

This conversation explores perfectionism, missionary culture, mental health, and more.

___________________

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

Venmo: https://account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories

Paypal: https://paypal.me/mormonstories

Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117

Welcome back to Part 34 of our series with Dr. John G. Turner! Today we are covering most of Chapter 27 in John Turner’s new book Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet. The chapter is called “Deep Water” and covers the year 1843.

The main topic for today is polygamy.

Join us as we discuss several of Joseph Smith’s wives such as Flora Woodworth, Eliza R. Snow, Sarah Ann Whitney, Lucy Walker, etc. John Dehlin challenges Dr. John Turner on specific aspects such as whether Emma Smith really did push Eliza R. Snow down the stairs and whether or not Porter Rockwell did actually attempt to assassinate Lilburn Boggs. We also discuss the validity of the William Clayton journals and postulate on why the church has yet to publish them.

Throughout 1843, Joseph Smith promised men and women salvation based on their willingness to enter into polygamy. He spent church funds on gifts for his wives, as well as buying some of them plots of land, and even travel expenses for some of the women (from England to Nauvoo). Joseph Smith used language that could be seen as coercive, for example, telling Lucy Walker that polygamy was a command of God and that he would give her “until tomorrow to decide this matter [of polygamy] and that “If you reject this message the gate will be closed forever against you.”

In this episode we tackle hard questions such as: Can people who do bad things also be good? Does good behavior negate seemingly abusive actions? Are people all bad and all good? Can Joseph Smith’s actions be seen as human trafficking?

This chapter in Mormonism is deeply problematic and disturbing, but Dr. John Turner handles it amazingly.

Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.

If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series here. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!

Purchase John Turner’s book here.

___________________

YouTube

At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.

Our overall mission is to:

1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology

2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis

3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions

🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today

One-time or recurring donations: https://donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m

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Join this channel to get access to perks:

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Our Platforms:

🌐Mormon Stories Blog: https://www.mormonstories.org/episodes

🎙️Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mormonstories

✳️Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1

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📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117