If you are following the controversy in Arkansas over defunding of PBS, this episode is a must for you! In the second half of our conversation with Gay White, former First Lady of Arkansas, April and Glen dig into why political discourse has grown so much more polarized — and who bears responsibility for turning it around. Gay shares what drew her to co-chair the Friends of Arkansas PBS initiative alongside Barbara Pryor, and why she believes preserving PBS is a cause that transcends party lines. We break down the Arkansas Educational Television Commission's recent vote to delay cutting PBS ties by 180 days, what the $2.1 million funding gap actually means, and how ordinary Arkansans can help close it. But the deeper question running through it all: in a media environment wired to reward outrage, how do you make a positive difference when you're just one person? Gay has a few thoughts on that — and a quote you won't forget.

In this first part of Glen and April’s interview with Gay White, former First Lady of Arkansas, Gay discussed her early involvement in Arkansas politics, including working on David Pryor's Senate campaign in the early 1970s. She then shared her experiences when her husband Frank White, a banker, decided to run for governor against Bill Clinton in the early 1980s. Gay proudly noted Frank’s ability after being elected to get all his key goals enacted legislatively during this first term. The discussion then focused on Gay's approach to cross-party relationships, particularly her friendship with Barbara Pryor, the former First Lady of a Democratic governor, who reached out to offer support as a new First Lady. They have since maintained their friendship through their shared experiences as former First Ladies. April and Gay discussed strategies for maintaining relationships with people who have different perspectives, as Gay emphasized the importance of grace, mercy, and understanding others' perspectives while acknowledging that sometimes setting boundaries may be necessary. Gay explained that she looks past political labels to focus on people's character and common bonds, drawing inspiration from her late husband Frank, who was skilled at reaching across political divides. She also emphasized the importance of broadening experiences through travel and meeting people from different backgrounds.

Check out part 3 of our conversation with April Chatham-Carpenter, new state coordinator for Braver Angels Arkansas, on our On The Other Hand podcast. Share with others who might find it of interest.

Summary: In this third and final part of our conversation with Dr. April Chatham-Carpenter, April reflects on what gives her hope for Arkansas and the nation. She describes Braver Angels' philosophy of "calling in rather than calling out," shares practical steps any listener can take to build better relationships across divides, and offers a personal invitation to the upcoming Braver Angels national convention in Philadelphia. April closes with a reminder that real change begins with listening — and that most Americans are closer to the middle than our politics suggest.

Check out part 2 of our conversation with April Chatham-Carpenter, new state coordinator for Braver Angels Arkansas, on our On The Other Hand podcast. Share with others who may like it.

Summary: In this second part of our interview with Dr. April Chatham-Carpenter, April discusses what she sees as Arkansas's most pressing divides — rural/urban, racial, economic, and faith-related — and shares what she's actually seen work in bridging them. She describes Braver Angels' new direction under CEO Maury Giles and his vision of "Courageous Citizenship," and talks about her priority of building local community alliances and engaging conservative faith communities across the state.

Check out part 1 of our conversation with April Chatham-Carpenter, new state coordinator for Braver Angels Arkansas, on our On The Other Hand podcast. Share freely with others.

Summary: In this first part of our interview with Dr. April Chatham-Carpenter, April shares her journey — from an aptitude test that launched a career in communication, to her discovery of Braver Angels and why its mission immediately resonated with her. She reflects on how communication sits at the heart of both polarization and healing, and describes her path from early Braver Angels volunteer to national leadership roles. April also introduces listeners to her new role as state co-coordinator for Braver Angels Arkansas and what drew her back to focus locally.

In part 2 of our conversation with Bob Estes, coordinator of Arkansas Peace Week, Bob gets practical—and personal—about what it really takes to bridge divides in Arkansas. He talks about why trust must come before persuasion, and he shares the surprisingly freeing impact of deleting Facebook from his phone. We also explore the deeper cultural and generational gaps shaping our state, why he’s hopeful about young leaders, and what it means to serve your community without being afraid to fail. Along the way, Bob reflects on how he hopes to be remembered—and the simple daily practice that keeps him grounded. It’s an honest, hopeful look at how change actually happens, often in quieter ways than we expect.

In this episode of On the Other Hand, Glen talks with Bob Estes, coordinator of Arkansas Peace Week and longtime advocate with the Arkansas Coalition for Peace and Justice, about what it really means to build a culture of peace in a deeply divided time. Bob reflects on the personal influences that shaped his commitment to fairness and equality, from mentors like Paul Wellstone and Woody Guthrie to his own experiences in community organizing. He explains how Arkansas Peace Week—centered around September 21—uses youth art and essay contests and practical lessons to plant seeds of nonviolence that may take years to fully bloom. The conversation also explores what Bob has learned about fostering respectful dialogue across political differences, citing as a hopeful example a recent bipartisan legislative success. It’s a thoughtful, grounded discussion about how peacebuilding happens—not just in theory, but in classrooms, communities, and everyday conversations.

In part 2 of their conversation with Jim Hudson, Secretary of Arkansas Dept of Finance & Administration, April and John explore how Jim leads his team in these polarized times, manages risk, integrates faith and integrity into public service, and finds hope amid division. Jim explores how leadership in government requires balancing experimentation with accountability, explaining how his team tests new processes, learns from early setbacks, and weighs financial investments against the real costs inefficiency imposes on taxpayers. He describes a service-oriented leadership style built on setting clear priorities, trusting teams to execute, and remaining visible during demanding periods, while emphasizing that respectful communication, active listening, and humility are essential when navigating political disagreements and policy debates. Jim also reflects on aligning personal convictions with organizational leadership, encouraging open internal debate while distinguishing deeply held principles from personal opinions. Connecting faith, character, and coaching to effective leadership, he discusses the major challenges facing Arkansas—such as poverty, educational outcomes, and rural population decline—while expressing optimism about economic growth in parts of the state and urging emerging leaders to focus on personal development, lifelong learning, and appreciation for the often-unseen contributions of public servants.