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The Game of Zen

The Game of Zen

By: Scott Berman and Paul Agostinelli
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The Game of Zen explores the often-overlooked ways in which professional, personal and spiritual growth are interrelated. We dive deep into the life teachings of the Buddha and the mindfulness practices of Zen, revealing how they can help us dramatically expand our possibilities for whole-hearted work, life and play. Play the game of life with wisdom, humor and skill for better businesses and happier lives.Copyright 2026 Scott Berman and Paul Agostinelli Economics Leadership Management & Leadership Personal Development Personal Success Spirituality
Episodes
  • E38 - Zen, Identity & The Game of Childhood

    E38 - Zen, Identity & The Game of Childhood
    Apr 3 2026
    In this episode, Scott and Paul pivot to a new series: The Games of Life. They explore why Zen is the 'Master Game' that prevents us from taking social rules too seriously. By deconstructing the Game of Childhood and the Game of Education, they reveal how our earliest 'characters' are built and how Zen practice helps us question the identities we've carried since the playground."Detailed Episode Timestamps00:00 – Introduction & The Philly-Boulder ConnectionScott and Paul check in from their respective coasts, discussing the seasonal shift as Paul prepares for the Spring Equinox retreat in Boulder’s uncharacteristically warm 80-degree weather.01:15 – March Madness & Rooting InterestsA brief detour into college hoops where Paul puts his money on Rick Pitino and St. John’s, while Scott sticks to his roots with the UConn men’s and women’s powerhouse programs.02:10 – Defining the "Master Game" of ZenThe hosts introduce a new series structure: viewing life as a collection of "games" (business, success, romance) and using Zen as the Master Game that makes all other social games more fluid and less "brutal."03:45 – The Game of Childhood: Initial Rule SetsThe conversation begins at birth, exploring how we don't choose our "starting map." They discuss how parents and environments dictate our early rules—like learning to eat, walk, and seek approval.06:20 – Choosing Your "Game Piece" (Identity)Using a Dungeons & Dragons metaphor, Paul explains how childhood is the first step in creating our "character" or avatar based on the messages we receive from family and society.07:40 – Belongingness & Tribal AffiliationScott reflects on his own childhood friend groups and the "game of peerhood," while Paul highlights the deep relational dynamics of negotiating who "our people" are and how we handle being "kicked out" of a group.10:15 – From Insecurity to AwarenessScott shares his personal journey from being a shy, "average" student to finding confidence later in life, illustrating how a good player of the game learns to grow and change their internal narrative.11:55 – Why Mindfulness is Hard for KidsPaul explains why he rarely teaches formal Zen to pre-teens, noting that their developmental stage makes it difficult to "quiet down," and that a "little taste" of mindfulness is usually more effective than a full practice.13:30 – The Three Components of Sincere PracticePaul outlines the "perfect storm" that leads to a spiritual path: experiencing the distress of an overactive mind, a glimpse that you are causing your own problems, and exposure to a practice that offers a solution.15:10 – The Game of Education & The "Book of Knowledge"A deep dive into how school feeds our ego. Zen challenges the "expert identity" by encouraging us to question everything we’ve learned—including scientific truths—and to detach our self-worth from test scores or credentials.18:50 – Sangha: Intentional BelongingThe hosts contrast "going along to get along" with the Zen concept of Sangha—a community built on shared values, vows, and conscious intention rather than just social convenience.20:15 – Family Karma & Conditioned IdentityA look at how siblings can have wildly different "games" based on where their parents were in life at the time, reinforcing the idea that our childhood identities are conditioned qualities rather than our true nature.23:20 – The Toddler Analogy: Learning to WalkPaul shares a powerful teaching from his master: spiritual practice is like a toddler learning to walk. They fall "over and over and over," but they never decide to give up—they just keep getting back up.25:00 – Closing: Transitioning to the Game of ParentingScott wraps up the session with a teaser for the next episode, where they will shift from being the "child player" to the "parent coach," exploring how our own upbringings influence how we raise the next generation.Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-game-of-zen/id1700988890Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2bjnPE66RC1bCL6h7i68jt?si=184f256fd76342e3&nd=1Podcast Landing Page: https://game-of-zen.captivate.fm/You Tube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMJ2A-vZkd5ba7bW_8KNFgdkXiSfQh_xvPaul AgostinelliOne Body Sangha -- https://www.onebodysangha.org/The Zen Shift Newsletter - https://thezenshift.substack.com/Email: GameofZenpodcast@gmail.com#GameOfZen #NobleTruths #entrepreneurship#Buddhism #Mindfulness #Zen #Concentration #Buddha #Attachment #Impermenance
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    37 mins
  • E37 - The Year in Review - Navigating the Paradigm Shifts Ahead

    E37 - The Year in Review - Navigating the Paradigm Shifts Ahead
    Mar 13 2026
    In this episode of the Game of Zen podcast, hosts Scott Berman and Paul Gyodo reflect on their conversations from 2025 to synthesize their core teachings and look ahead toward 2026. Utilizing NotebookLM to map out their previous content, the hosts introduce an AI-generated infographic shaped like a tree to represent the four primary "branches" of their practice: Navigating Paradigm Shifts, Cultivating Wisdom and Independence, Managing Mindset and Anxiety, and Community and Connection.Episode Show Notes00:00 – Introduction and 2025 Reflections Scott and Paul open the show by discussing the transition into February and their process of reflecting on the conversations and lessons from 2025.01:21 – Leveraging AI for Conceptual Modeling Paul discusses the "brilliant" utility of NotebookLM in creating visual infographics and slide decks to map out complex content pillars, such as "The Six Realms of LinkedIn".02:40 – The Four Branches of the "Game of Zen" Tree The hosts introduce an AI-generated infographic shaped like a tree with the Buddha at the center. The four primary branches represent the core themes of the podcast: Navigating Paradigm Shifts, Cultivating Wisdom and Independence, Managing Mindset and Anxiety, and Community and Connection.04:45 – Branch 1: Navigating Paradigm Shifts (Inner and Outer Games) A deep dive into the shift from a behavioral, "outer-focused" game space to an inner-focused space informed by Zen rules. Scott and Paul discuss the "Bodhicattva shift"—turning your personal history into purpose by transforming Karma (conditioned existence) into Dharma (wisdom/compassion).08:34 – Branch 2: Cultivating Wisdom, Independence, and Sovereignty The hosts define the "goal" of the Game of Zen. Unlike the "karmic game" of material success, this path focuses on Prajna (wisdom), Karuna (compassion), and true sovereignty. They emphasize that while everyone forges their own unique path, the effort put into the journey is what cultivates goodness.11:35 – "Rolling Experience into Practice" Paul explains a key vow from the Fusatsu ceremony: the commitment to roll every experience—regardless of whether it is "good" or "bad"—into one’s practice.12:51 – Branch 3: Managing Mindset and Anxiety (The Skills of the Game) Discussion on the internal skills required to play the game, including managing reactivity and embracing impermanence. The hosts use a sports training analogy to explain how mindful mastery helps one handle high-pressure moments in business and personal life.17:53 – Branch 4: Community and Connection Exploring why you can't play the "Game of Zen" alone. They discuss the importance of the Sangha, the roles of coaches and mentors, and how to maintain Zen practice when interacting with people who are playing different "social games".21:05 – Aging and the Evolution of Practice Scott and Paul reflect on how the "game" changes as you age. They emphasize that while smarts may come with age, wisdom is earned through consistent meditation and updating one's practice to fit shifting life circumstances.22:56 – Looking Ahead to 2026: Navigating Global Breakdown Paul shares his perspective on the coming year, anticipating a dramatic breakdown and dissolution of traditional international, political, and economic orders. They argue that the millennia-old rules of Zen are the most reliable tools for empowering your life during these challenging times.25:52 – Why You Can’t Play the "Game of Zen" Alone The hosts transition into the fourth branch of their "Game of Zen" tree: Community and Connection. Paul explains that while you can play a game like golf alone, you lack a real assessment of your progress without others. He emphasizes that this stage is about harmonizing your wisdom and "awakeness" with other beings.27:15 – Shifting from Social Games to the "Main Game" Paul shares a personal reflection on the gift of shifting focus away from karmic or social games. He describes a "role-playing" approach to life, where he may pretend to play conventional social games while his "main game" remains the internal practice of Zen. This shift allows for collaboration rather than competition when engaging with others on the same path.29:20 – Navigating a World That "Isn't Playing the Game" A discussion on the "trickiness" of maintaining Zen practice when interacting with people who are not on a Buddhist path. Paul notes that because most people are playing different "games," it is essential to have a community of other players to provide support and guidance.30:30 – From "Rookie" to the Big Leagues: The Role of Coaches Scott shares his experience moving from a "rookie Buddhist" to higher levels of practice. He compares the Zen community to a sports team, where players need teammates, opponents, and coaches to help them "raise their level". Paul agrees, noting that while one must forge their own path, guides and veteran players are essential to the journey.32:15 – Aging, ...
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    36 mins
  • E36 - The Boardroom Bodhisattva: Mark Thornton on Spirituality and Investment Banking

    E36 - The Boardroom Bodhisattva: Mark Thornton on Spirituality and Investment Banking
    Mar 6 2026
    Can you find enlightenment on a London Underground platform or in the middle of a £25 million corporate crisis? In this episode of Game of Zen, hosts Scott Berman and Paul Gyodo Agostinelli sit down with Mark Thornton, former COO of JPMorgan Private Bank and author of Meditation in a New York Minute. Mark shares his radical journey from a "caffeine-addicted stress junkie" in the high-stakes world of global finance to a renowned Zen teacher and leadership consultant for Wharton and Harvard Law.Mark demystifies the idea that spiritual practice requires a mountaintop, offering instead a "micro-dosing" approach to mindfulness designed for the world’s busiest professionals. This conversation explores how to break the false correlation between stress and results, and why 5% of Wall Street is quietly fueling a spiritual revolution.Show Notes & Timestamps[0:00] – Introduction to Game of Zen Hosts Scott Berman and Paul Guyoto Augustineelli introduce the podcast's mission: exploring the intersection of professional, personal, and spiritual growth through the lens of Zen.[1:25] – Meet Mark Thornton An overview of Mark’s background as the former COO of JPMorgan Private Bank in London, a best-selling author, and an instructor for leadership programs at Wharton Business School and Harvard Law School.[3:45] – The Catalyst: A Father’s Miracle and a Childhood Awakening Mark shares the story of his father’s terminal cancer diagnosis and subsequent 25-year survival, which led to Mark's first profound awakening experience at age 13.[6:15] – Banking: "Where Awakening Goes to Die" Mark describes his life as a "caffeine-addicted stress junkie" in London's high-finance world, struggling to find the 20 minutes for traditional meditation while his physical health suffered.[10:30] – The £25 Million Crisis and the Tube Station Epiphany How spiritual practice Bore fruit during a corporate merger crisis and a transformative experience of "divine light" while standing on a London Underground platform.[14:10] – "I'm Pregnant with a Book": Leaving JP Morgan The story of Mark asking for a year off to write, being told no by his boss, and ultimately leaving the bank to meet 32 spiritual teachers across 13 countries.[19:45] – The "New York Minute" Method Explaining the breakthrough concept of "micro-dosing" mindfulness: practicing in small, cumulative moments throughout the day rather than one long consecutive session.[24:00] – Corporate Spirituality: Wall Street’s Thirst for Wisdom Mark discusses bringing "Corporate Spirituality" to Goldman Sachs and finding that, while 85% of Wall Street may not be interested, 5% are "thirsty" for deep spiritual tools.[30:20] – Relanguaging Spirituality for the "Untouched" The challenge of translating ancient wisdom for people who feel "too busy" for meditation and avoiding jargon like Sanskrit to reach a broader audience.[36:15] – Rapid Cycling and Global Consciousness A discussion on how the modern "chaos" of the world (AI, geopolitics) acts as fuel for awakening, forcing individuals to bump up against their limitations and seek healing.[43:40] – The Three Sacred Marriages Integrating the three areas of life: Self, Work, and Others. Mark and Paul discuss the importance of not bypassing professional or relational paths in favor of a monastic life.[48:10] – Leading with Love: Transforming the Boardroom Practical advice on seeing work as a platform for love and wisdom, including how to transform annual appraisals into sacred exchanges.[52:30] – Final Zen Wisdom and Closing Quotes Mark shares his favorite Zen quotes: "In meditation there are only ever beginners" and "To disturb something is to be attached to it".Meditation in a New York Minute - https://www.amazon.com/Meditation-New-York-Minute-Super/dp/1591794293Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-game-of-zen/id1700988890Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/2bjnPE66RC1bCL6h7i68jt?si=184f256fd76342e3&nd=1Podcast Landing Page: https://game-of-zen.captivate.fm/You Tube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMJ2A-vZkd5ba7bW_8KNFgdkXiSfQh_xvPaul AgostinelliOne Body Sangha -- https://www.onebodysangha.org/The Zen Shift Newsletter - https://thezenshift.substack.com/One Body Sangha - https://www.onebodysangha.org/Email: GameofZenpodcast@gmail.com#GameOfZen #NobleTruths #entrepreneurship#Buddhism #Mindfulness #Zen #Concentration #Buddha #Attachment #Impermenance
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    48 mins
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